ON THE ROPES (6)

but why not, yeah sure I've got no great ambition to be on television.

But you seemed a bit uneasy in the ….

'cause I couldn't care less to tell the truth and I know it seems, he would say that; but I don't believe I'm alone in that…...shows that have successful. That's not what I do. This is purely a means to fund a life you know. I've got a agreeable old house up on Blackheath and everything else and that's what I do. One thing I've learnt since I've been working with Chris….Evans, is that you can actually, if you put half a mind to it and want to sacrifice, pretty much…the other sides of your life. Walk in and get your own team and say, "This is how this show is going to be done". I'm never like that. I never am like that. I mean I'm not culpable as far as work colleagues go, but I do live a pretty lush old life and I'm not going to start slowing it down to turn up at work more and that is the great fault of a load of those programmes. I was coming in on one wing you know, "Dan please give us your complete attention, come to rehearsals, please write something before two hours before we go on air", but I can't." When I write for other people I do, I mean I'm very diligent if I'm writing for Angus Deaton, Jonathan, Chris, I'll write the script. For meself, "Nah!". This is not what I do, I don't know what I do but it's not this.

At the risk of sounding like a terribly pompous Radio Four Presenter, that's a bit irresponsible isn't it?

Yeah, but it is, but it depends on whether you price your career………..I don't see a career. I don't look at it and think….

No, but you're inviting millions of people to sit down and watch you….

Yeah but I know, but I've got such a disrespect in the end for television. I don't think, I think it's fatally flawed in the first place some of the things………

But why did you want to appear on it?

Because they've given me huge amounts of money. Huge amounts of money. I think I was getting quarter of a million to make some……What are you going to say, "No?" What, I'm going to save the nation, I'm going to be the respected broadcaster who when he's gone said, "I'll tell you who was pretty good". I may have irritated and got on everyone's nerves, but it doesn't bother me. It really did not bother me. I was getting a huge amount of money….why would I have advertised Daz and Mars, if I was looking to become Clive James? I'll be Clive James in real-life thanks, not on screen. I'd far rather be entertaining really than some old bore who hangs around Green Rooms all the time and worries about his career.

This isn't the language of a bitter man is it?

(Laughter) Look it would be were I still knocking on television's door and saying and believe me. Okay, I'm here today with you, but I hope this is the kind of programme I'd like to do, when you're doing radio and you can talk and you're not going to be edited up. But I suspect, if I wanted to , I could get a job at, I don't know, Granada Plus or something or be on telly.

After what you've said today?

No, no, exactly. No it's not bitter. See the thing is that this is to suggest that everything was catastrophe and ashes; no, no, I mean Win Lose or Draw, I left out at the fourth series. You may say it was only a morning game show, pretty good work in it, it was pretty good. Some of the talk shows were actually all right, there were some bits of those that worked and it makes you think what might have been. But it depends whether you say you're empire-building. I don't believe, I think television is a pretty nit-witty thing to do; I think it's like the Deutsche mark after the First World War. You don't have to think that what you do is great or even good.

No great art, but it shows a bit of contempt for the audience.

You see, you keep coming back to that. I don't think of an audience at all.

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